[topicmapmail] Re: Topic Map - scope
Dichev, Christo
dichevc@wssu.edu
Tue, 14 Oct 2003 15:04:29 -0400
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Thomas,
> It would be better if you explained what you want to achieve before
> writing some XTM.
I'll try - I'll use some XTM again, because this would enable me
to explain better the origin of my questions and probably the source
of my confusions and misconceptions. Apologies if my questions sound
too naive.
The straightforward approach to differentiating the units for more
able and less able students is to define to units (unit-1 and unit-2)
and link them using an association (intended-for) - somethinh like
the following:
<topic id="unit-1">
<instanceOf><topicRef xlink:href="#leson"/></instanceOf>
<baseName>
<baseNameString> First Unit</baseNameString>
</baseName>
<occurrence>
<instanceOf><topicRef xlink:href="#webpage"/></instanceOf>
<resourceRef
xlink:href="http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect2.html"/>
</occurrence>
</topic>
<topic id="unit-2">
<instanceOf><topicRef xlink:href="#leson"/></instanceOf>
<baseName>
<baseNameString> Second Unit</baseNameString>
</baseName>
<occurrence>
<instanceOf><topicRef xlink:href="#webpage"/></instanceOf>
<resourceRef xlink:href="http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect1.htm"/>
</occurrence>
</topic>
<association>
<instanceOf>
<topicRef xlink:href="#intended-for"/>
</instanceOf>
<member>
<roleSpec>
<topicRef xlink:href="#average-student"/>
</roleSpec>
<topicRef xlink:href="#unit-1"/>
</member>
<member>
<roleSpec>
<topicRef xlink:href="#good-student"/>
</roleSpec>
<topicRef xlink:href="#unit-2"/>
</member>
</association>
My first intention was to combine unit-1 and unit-2 into a single
unit and to achieve the same effect, using scope. That's where I
got stuck.
Please excuse me if I am asking something too trivial.
Christo
What you present seems a bit confusing. You seem to
want to assign occurrences to associations, which is not kosher. You
would assign those occurrences to a topic, whose subject is the
association in question, not to the instanceOf topic.
In your example, you have said that the same topic (unit-1) is the type
of the association, and also is a role-playing topic in the association.
Your roles are the same type as the occurrence types. Neither of
these makes much sense to me.
Scopes work fine for interactive filtering, but you have to decide what
you want to accomplish.
How you represent your units depends on how you view them and how they
all fit together. If you want to express that a unit uses different web
pages for average and good students, you can do that using scopes as
youhave, without messing with an association.
Alternatively, you could decide to link the unit with the web pages
using an association - then the unit topic would not also have them as
occurrences.
Or you could decide that there are really two units one for average and
one for good students, and link them using an association.
You cannot necessarily expect a general-purpose UI to display these
alternatives exactly the way you would like, though. It might or might
not. For example, one of my standard UIs can filter topic names or
associations by scope, but not occurrences.
Your phrse "to filter some information (ignore irrelevant occurrences,
roles) based on the user interaction with a topic map" does not explain
enough about what you want.
Cheers,
Tom P
> <topic id="unit-1">
> <instanceOf><topicRef xlink:href="#leson"/></instanceOf>
> <baseName>
> <baseNameString> First Unit</baseNameString>
> </baseName>
> <baseName>
> <scope>
> <topicRef xlink:href="#average-student"/>
> </scope>
> <baseNameString>Unit for average</baseNameString>
> </baseName>
> <occurrence>
> <scope><topicRef xlink:href="#average-student"/></scope>
> <instanceOf><topicRef xlink:href="#webpage"/></instanceOf>
> <resourceRef
> xlink:href="http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect1.htm"/>
> </occurrence>
> <baseName>
> <scope>
> <topicRef xlink:href="#good-student"/>
> </scope>
> <baseNameString>Unit for good</baseNameString>
> </baseName>
> <occurrence>
> <scope><topicRef xlink:href="#good-student"/></scope>
> <instanceOf><topicRef xlink:href="#webpage"/></instanceOf>
> <resourceRef
> xlink:href="http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect2.html"/>
> </occurrence>
> </topic>
>
> Now given that topic to use it to type an association, i.e.
>
> <association>
> <instanceOf>
> <topicRef xlink:href="#unit-1"/>
> </instanceOf>
> <member>
> <scope><topicRef xlink:href="#average-student"/></scope>
> <roleSpec>
> <topicRef xlink:href="#average-student"/>
> </roleSpec>
> <topicRef xlink:href="#unit-1"/>
> </member>
> <member>
> <scope><topicRef xlink:href="#good-student"/></scope>
> <roleSpec>
> <topicRef xlink:href="#good-student"/>
> </roleSpec>
> <topicRef xlink:href="#unit-1"/>
> </member>
> </association>
>
> so that the Omnigator displays different occurrences depending on
> the context, say based on the "current topic". May be this is a
> wrong approach. My intention is construct an example that is able
> to filter some information (ignore irrelevant occurrences, roles)
> based on the user interaction with a topic map.
>
> Any help in this direction will be appreciated.
>
> Thank you,
> Christo
>
>
> Hi Christo,
>
> * Christo Dichev
> |
> | However I can't generate simple and meaningful examples to start up.
> | For instance, I can not figure out how can the resources in the
> | following topic be displayed depending on the context
> | ("average-student" or "good-student").
>
> Not sure what you mean here. Your XTM snippets look perfectly OK with
> me, so I'm not sure what the problem is.
>
> If you want to try them out, just load the topic map in the Omnigator,
> then click on the "Filter" link near the top. You can select your
> preferred scope there, and the Omnigator will automatically start
> filtering. Was that what you wanted to know, or did I completely
> misunderstand your question?
>
> --
> Lars Marius Garshol, Ontopian <URL: http://www.ontopia.net >
> GSM: +47 98 21 55 50 <URL: http://www.garshol.priv.no >
>
> _______________________________________________
> topicmapmail mailing list
> topicmapmail@infoloom.com
> http://www.infoloom.com/mailman/listinfo/topicmapmail
>
_______________________________________________
topicmapmail mailing list
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http://www.infoloom.com/mailman/listinfo/topicmapmail
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<TITLE>RE: [topicmapmail] Re: Topic Map - scope</TITLE>
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<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Thomas,</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>> It would be better if you explained what you =
want to achieve before </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> writing some XTM. </FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>I'll try - I'll use some XTM again, because =
this would enable me </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>to explain better the origin of my questions and =
probably the source </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>of my confusions and misconceptions. Apologies if my =
questions sound </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>too naive. </FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>The straightforward approach to differentiating the =
units for more </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>able and less able students is to define to =
units (unit-1 and unit-2) </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>and link them using an association =
(intended-for) - somethinh like </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>the following:</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2><topic id=3D"unit-1"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <instanceOf><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#leson"/></instanceOf> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <baseName> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <baseNameString> First =
Unit</baseNameString> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </baseName> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <occurrence> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <instanceOf><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#webpage"/></instanceOf> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <resourceRef =
xlink:href=3D"<A =
HREF=3D"http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect2.html" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect2.html</A>"=
;/> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </occurrence> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2></topic></FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2><topic id=3D"unit-2"> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <instanceOf><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#leson"/></instanceOf> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <baseName> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <baseNameString> Second =
Unit</baseNameString> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </baseName> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <occurrence> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <instanceOf><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#webpage"/></instanceOf> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <resourceRef =
xlink:href=3D"<A =
HREF=3D"http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect1.htm" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect1.htm</A>"=
/> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </occurrence> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2></topic> </FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2><association></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <instanceOf></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#intended-for"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </instanceOf></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> =
<roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> =
<topicRef xlink:href=3D"#average-student"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> =
</roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#unit-1"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> =
<roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> =
<topicRef xlink:href=3D"#good-student"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> =
</roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> <topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#unit-2"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> </association></FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>My first intention was to combine unit-1 and unit-2 =
into a single </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>unit and to achieve the same effect, using scope. =
That's where I </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>got stuck.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Please excuse me if I am asking something too =
trivial.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>Christo</FONT>
</P>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>What you present seems a bit confusing. You =
seem to </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>want to assign occurrences to associations, which is =
not kosher. You </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>would assign those occurrences to a topic, whose =
subject is the </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>association in question, not to the instanceOf =
topic.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>In your example, you have said that the same topic =
(unit-1) is the type </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>of the association, and also is a role-playing topic =
in the association. </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2> Your roles are the same type as the =
occurrence types. Neither of </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>these makes much sense to me.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Scopes work fine for interactive filtering, but you =
have to decide what </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>you want to accomplish.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>How you represent your units depends on how you view =
them and how they </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>all fit together. If you want to express that =
a unit uses different web </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>pages for average and good students, you can do that =
using scopes as </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>youhave, without messing with an association.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Alternatively, you could decide to link the unit with =
the web pages </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>using an association - then the unit topic would not =
also have them as </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>occurrences.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Or you could decide that there are really two units =
one for average and </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>one for good students, and link them using an =
association.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>You cannot necessarily expect a general-purpose UI to =
display these </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>alternatives exactly the way you would like, =
though. It might or might </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>not. For example, one of my standard UIs can =
filter topic names or </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>associations by scope, but not occurrences.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Your phrse "to filter some information (ignore =
irrelevant occurrences, </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>roles) based on the user interaction with a topic =
map" does not explain </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>enough about what you want.</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Cheers,</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>Tom P</FONT>
</P>
<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <topic id=3D"unit-1"></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <instanceOf><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#leson"/></instanceOf></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <baseName></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <baseNameString> =
First Unit</baseNameString></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </baseName></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <baseName></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<topicRef xlink:href=3D"#average-student"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
</scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<baseNameString>Unit for average</baseNameString></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </baseName></FONT>=
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <occurrence></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <scope><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#average-student"/></scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<instanceOf><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#webpage"/></instanceOf></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <resourceRef </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> xlink:href=3D"<A =
HREF=3D"http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect1.htm" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect1.htm</A>"=
/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </occurrence></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <baseName></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<topicRef xlink:href=3D"#good-student"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
</scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<baseNameString>Unit for good</baseNameString></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
</baseName></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <occurrence></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<scope><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#good-student"/></scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<instanceOf><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#webpage"/></instanceOf></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <resourceRef </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> xlink:href=3D"<A =
HREF=3D"http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect2.html" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://wssu.edu/faculty/dichevc/ex/sect2.html</A>"=
;/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </occurrence></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </topic></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Now given that topic to use it to type an =
association, i.e.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <association></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<instanceOf></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<topicRef xlink:href=3D"#unit-1"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
</instanceOf></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <scope><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#average-student"/></scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<topicRef xlink:href=3D"#average-student"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
</roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#unit-1"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <scope><topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#good-student"/></scope></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
<topicRef xlink:href=3D"#good-student"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
</roleSpec></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <topicRef =
xlink:href=3D"#unit-1"/></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </member></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </association></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> so that the Omnigator displays different =
occurrences depending on</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> the context, say based on the "current =
topic". May be this is a</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> wrong approach. My intention is construct an =
example that is able</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> to filter some information (ignore irrelevant =
occurrences, roles)</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> based on the user interaction with a topic =
map.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Any help in this direction will be =
appreciated.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Thank you,</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Christo</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Hi Christo,</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> * Christo Dichev</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> |</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> | However I can't generate simple and =
meaningful examples to start up.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> | For instance, I can not figure out how can =
the resources in the</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> | following topic be displayed depending on the =
context</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> | ("average-student" or =
"good-student").</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Not sure what you mean here. Your XTM snippets =
look perfectly OK with</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> me, so I'm not sure what the problem is.</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> If you want to try them out, just load the =
topic map in the Omnigator,</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> then click on the "Filter" link near =
the top. You can select your</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> preferred scope there, and the Omnigator will =
automatically start</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> filtering. Was that what you wanted to know, or =
did I completely</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> misunderstand your question?</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> -- </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> Lars Marius Garshol, =
Ontopian <URL: <A =
HREF=3D"http://www.ontopia.net" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.ontopia.net</A> ></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> GSM: +47 98 21 55 =
50 &nbs=
p; <URL: <A =
HREF=3D"http://www.garshol.priv.no" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.garshol.priv.no</A> ></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> =
_______________________________________________</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> topicmapmail mailing list</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> topicmapmail@infoloom.com</FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> <A =
HREF=3D"http://www.infoloom.com/mailman/listinfo/topicmapmail" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.infoloom.com/mailman/listinfo/topicmapmail<=
/A></FONT>
<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>> </FONT>
</P>
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